[Wrf-users] Upper boundary cfl error (UNCLASSIFIED)

Mark Stoelinga mstoelinga at 3tier.com
Thu Mar 4 15:49:44 MST 2010


I can also confirm what Bob and David suggested...I had the same problem for 4/3-km simulations, and solved it the same way ( don't recall if we did 4 or 5 smoothing passes).

What I do recall is that the resultant smoothing of the terrain is not as drastic as one might fear from 5 smoothing passes.  The differences are noticeable, but most of the hi-res structure in the terrain is still there.  And the WRF crash problem goes away.

Mark

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On Mar 4, 2010, at 1:17 PM, David Ovens wrote:

> All,
> 
> Bob's suggestion about using a different smoothing option in geogrid
> is the only way I've been able to consistently run at 4/3-km
> resolution over a region that covers Whistler, BC.  We have to do 5
> smoothing passes.  
> 
> So, in geogrid/GEOGRID.TBL.ARW for all 
> 
>  name = HGT_M
>  name = HGT_U
>  name = HGT_V
> 
> I have 
> 
>        smooth_option = smth-desmth_special; smooth_passes=5
> 
> That has worked very well.  We had the same problems trying all of the
> other things that Bob mentions.
> 
> Note that we run our high resolution run after running ndown.exe, so
> we're able to use smooth_passes=1 for the topography of our coarser
> domains. 
> 
> David
> -- 
> David Ovens		 e-mail: ovens at atmos.washington.edu
> Research Meteorologist    phone: (206) 685-8108
> Dept of Atm. Sciences      plan: Real-time MM5 forecasting for the
> Box 351640                        Pacific Northwest
> University of Washington          http://www.atmos.washington.edu/mm5rt
> Seattle, WA  98195               Weather Graphics and Loops
>                                  http://www.atmos.washington.edu/~ovens/loops
> 
> On Thu, Mar 04, 2010 at 11:47:40AM -0700, Dumais, Bob (Civ, ARL/CISD) wrote:
>> Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
>> Caveats: NONE
>> 
>> All,
>> 
>>          I found this issue as well, over very steep terrain regions.
>> For example, I tried running WRF in triple nest to 300 m grid spacing
>> over the White Sands Missile Range, Nm area (2.7 km; 900m; 300 m using
>> NAM 218 ICs and LBCs). Simply interpolating to 300 m from the default
>> USGS 1 km data worked fine. However, trying to run with 300 m terrain
>> generated from higher resolution NEDS arc 1 sec data causes the model to
>> crash everytime no matter which case/external dataset I try. It always
>> happens within the first 2 min of model integration.  It looks like a
>> singular point blows up/produces an instability where there is a very
>> steep model terrain slope. In fact, trying to run a grid recently for
>> the Olympic venue region near Whistler, BC the same thing happened. Blow
>> ups (CFL violations due to big values of W) in low levels at a single
>> steep slope point in the domain, within 2 min of integration. This was
>> for a 1 km grid spacing domain where the terrain was generated from the
>> default 1 km USGS data! At 3 km grid spacing, the model runs fine. 
>> 
>>         In the BC domain, I believe the "magic" point where things were
>> blowing up was found to be found near 50.13 N and -123.625. It is not a
>> boundary point. I have tried very small time steps, different vertical
>> grid structures, microphysics, radiation, PBL physics, land surface, 6th
>> order diffusion strength, and even divergence damping strength (smdiv in
>> namelist). Nothing things to prevent this for the WSMR or Whistler areas
>> I mentioned. I am cc'ing Dr Jimy Dudhia this email, since I think he may
>> be able to add something regarding this possible model slope issue. I
>> notice that in my cases where the instabilities occur, model slopes are
>> pretty high and may be approaching 45 deg.  My gut feeling is that slope
>> may become an issue for some domains at grid spacings about 1 km or
>> less. Maybe a different terrain smoothing option in geogrid could help??
>> Where are you running your model?
>> 
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: wrf-users-bounces at ucar.edu [mailto:wrf-users-bounces at ucar.edu] On
>> Behalf Of Min Zhu
>> Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 3:34 AM
>> To: wrf-users at ucar.edu
>> Subject: Re: [Wrf-users] Upper boundary cfl error
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> It seems that the problem is in lower boundary rather than upper
>> boundary. Also your time step seems to be bigger.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Min Zhu
>> 
>> Meso-scale Wind Modeller
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> D  +44 (0)1923 299 360
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> RES Group, registered in England and Wales with Company Number 1589961
>> 
>> Registered Office: Beaufort Court, Egg Farm Lane, Kings Langley,
>> Hertfordshire WD4 8LR
>> 
>> P please consider the environment - do you really need to print this
>> email?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: wrf-users-bounces at ucar.edu [mailto:wrf-users-bounces at ucar.edu] On
>> Behalf Of Andre Pattantyus
>> Sent: 04 March 2010 00:11
>> To: wrf-users at ucar.edu
>> Subject: [Wrf-users] Upper boundary cfl error
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> I am getting these few errors at my upper boundary.  Among other things,
>> I have tried using the new damping option, diff_opt =2, because I am
>> using running towards an LES in my inner domain. A solution seems easy
>> but so far my attempts have not yielded success. below is my namelist.
>> 
>> 
>> 3  points exceeded cfl=2 in domain d03 at time 2006-03-29_12:00:16 hours
>>  MAX AT i,j,k:  40 80 4  vert_cfl,w,d(eta)= 2.263442993 -80.54151917
>> 0.2999961376E-02
>>  3  points exceeded cfl=2 in domain d03 at time 2006-03-29_12:00:16
>> hours
>>  MAX AT i,j,k:  40 80 4  vert_cfl,w,d(eta)= 2.485260963 13.09560013
>> 0.2999961376E-02
>>  3  points exceeded cfl=2 in domain d03 at time 2006-03-29_12:00:16
>> hours
>>  MAX AT i,j,k:  41 80 4  vert_cfl,w,d(eta)= 2.567909241 -117.0119095
>> 0.2999961376E-02
>>  22  points exceeded cfl=2 in domain d03 at time
>> 2006-03-29_12:00:16+08/09 hours
>>  MAX AT i,j,k:  40 80 4  vert_cfl,w,d(eta)= 6.311451435 -170.4623871
>> 0.2999961376E-02
>>  36  points exceeded cfl=2 in domain d03 at time
>> 2006-03-29_12:00:16+08/09 hours
>>  MAX AT i,j,k:  40 80 3  vert_cfl,w,d(eta)= 6.109247208 -223.6106720
>> 0.2799987793E-02
>>      AVOST IN VILKA
>> ~
>> ~
>> ~
>> 
>> &time_control
>> run_days                            = 2,
>> run_hours                           = 36,
>> run_minutes                         = 0,
>> run_seconds                         = 0,
>> start_year                          = 2006, 2006, 2006,
>> start_month                         = 03,   03,   03,
>> start_day                           = 29,   29,   29,
>> start_hour                          = 12,   12,   12,
>> start_minute                        = 00,   00,   00,
>> start_second                        = 00,   00,   00,
>> end_year                            = 2006, 2006, 2006,
>> end_month                           = 03,   03,   03,
>> end_day                             = 31,   31,   31,
>> end_hour                            = 00,   00,   00,
>> end_minute                          = 00,   00,   00,
>> end_second                          = 00,   00,   00,
>> interval_seconds                    = 10800
>> input_from_file                     = .true.,.true.,.true.,
>> history_interval                    =  60,  60,   60,
>> frames_per_outfile                  = 1000, 1000, 1000,
>> restart                             = .false.,
>> restart_interval                    = 720,
>> io_form_history                     = 2
>> io_form_restart                     = 2
>> io_form_input                       = 2
>> io_form_boundary                    = 2
>> debug_level                         = 0
>> /
>> 
>> &domains
>> time_step                           = 8,
>> time_step_fract_num                 = 0,
>> time_step_fract_den                 = 1,
>> max_dom                             = 3,
>> e_we                                = 121,   169,  241,
>> e_sn                                = 121,   169,  241,
>> e_vert                              = 61,    61,   61,
>> p_top_requested                     = 5000,
>> num_metgrid_levels                  = 40,
>> num_metgrid_soil_levels             = 4,
>> dx                                  = 4500, 1500, 500,
>> dy                                  = 4500, 1500, 500,
>> grid_id                             = 1,     2,     3,
>> parent_id                           = 0,     1,     2,
>> i_parent_start                      = 1,    33,    53,
>> j_parent_start                      = 1,    33,    53,
>> parent_grid_ratio                   = 1,     3,     3,
>> parent_time_step_ratio              = 1,     3,     3,
>> feedback                            = 0,
>> smooth_option                       = 0,
>> eta_levels                          =  1.0000, .9976, .9948, .9920,
>> .9890,
>> .9858, .9825, .9790, .9754, .9718, .9679, .9637, .9590, .9538, .9480,
>> .9415, .9340, .9251, .9144, .9020, .8883, .8736, .8582, .8420, .8253,
>> .8079, .7900, .7714, .7523, .7326, .7124, .6915, .6699, .6477, .6248,
>> .6015, .5779, .5540, .5300, .5057, .4812, .4566, .4319, .4070, .3822,
>> .3576, .3333, .3100, .2881, .2679, .2494, .2316, .2135, .1936, .1707,
>> .1445, .1159, .0863, .0569, .0282, .0000,  /
>> 
>> 
>> &physics
>> mp_physics                          = 8,     8,     8,
>> ra_lw_physics                       = 1,     1,     1,
>> ra_sw_physics                       = 2,     2,     2,
>> radt                                = 4,     4,     4,
>> sf_sfclay_physics                   = 4,     4,     4,
>> sf_surface_physics                  = 3,     3,     3,
>> bl_pbl_physics                      = 4,     4,     4,
>> bldt                                = 0,     0,     0,
>> cu_physics                          = 0,     0,     0,
>> cudt                                = 0,     0,     0,
>> isfflx                              = 1,
>> ifsnow                              = 0,
>> icloud                              = 1,
>> surface_input_source                = 1,
>> num_soil_layers                     = 6,
>> sf_urban_physics                    = 0,
>> maxiens                             = 1,
>> maxens                              = 3,
>> maxens2                             = 3,
>> maxens3                             = 16,
>> ensdim                              = 144,
>> slope_rad                           = 1,     1,     1,
>> topo_shading                        = 1,     1,     1,
>> shadlen                             = 25000.,
>> /
>> 
>> &fdda
>> /
>> 
>> &dynamics
>> w_damping                           = 1,
>> diff_opt                            = 2,
>> km_opt                              = 4,
>> diff_6th_opt                        = 2,      2,      2,
>> diff_6th_factor                     = 0.12,   0.12,   0.12,
>> base_temp                           = 290.
>> damp_opt                            = 3,
>> zdamp                               = 5000.,  5000.,  5000.,
>> dampcoef                            = 0.2,    0.2,    0.2
>> khdif                               = 0,      0,      0,
>> kvdif                               = 0,      0,      0,
>> non_hydrostatic                     = .true., .true., .true.,
>> moist_adv_opt                       = 1,      1,      1,
>> scalar_adv_opt                      = 1,      1,      1,
>> /
>> 
>> &bdy_control
>> spec_bdy_width                      = 5,
>> spec_zone                           = 1,
>> relax_zone                          = 4,
>> specified                           = .true., .false.,.false.,
>> nested                              = .false., .true., .true.,
>> /
>> 
>> &grib2
>> /
>> 
>> &namelist_quilt
>> nio_tasks_per_group = 0,
>> nio_groups = 1,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Andre Pattantyus, Graduate Student Research Assistant Marine and
>> Environmental Systems, Florida Institute of Technology 150 W. University
>> Blvd, Melbourne, FL 32901
>> 
>> Phone: (321) 674-8330 | Fax: (321) 674-7212 | Email:
>> apattantyus2008 at fit.edu
>> 
>> 
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