[Proflist] Re: Fwd: Draft Bachelor's Degree Statement

Alan Robock robock at envsci.rutgers.edu
Thu Oct 28 11:44:41 MDT 2004


Dear Richard,
Thanks for your reply.  Your example is appropriate for a program where 
the teaching load is 5 courses per year and you only have an 
undergraduate program.  In a research univ. with a teaching load of 2 
courses per year, and a responsibility for both an undergraduate and 
graduate program, it is easy to see that 10 faculty members would be 
needed for a robust program, and 6 would be a minimum, assuming some of 
the courses could be taught by faculty from related departments.  I 
would like the statement to reflect these situations, too, while 
including ones like yours.

Alan

Professor Alan Robock
   Editor, JGR - Atmospheres
   Director, Center for Environmental Prediction
Department of Environmental Sciences              Phone: +1-732-932-9478
Rutgers University                                  Fax: +1-732-932-8644
14 College Farm Road                   E-mail: robock at envsci.rutgers.edu
New Brunswick, NJ 08901-8551  USA      http://envsci.rutgers.edu/~robock


On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Mower, Richard N wrote:

> I thought that the recommendation for a minimum of 3 faculty was
> intended to ensure a program will have faculty with the expertise to
> cover the three important areas in a typical major; synoptic, dynamic,
> physical (incl instrumentation).  We at Central Michigan Univ are in the
> process of changing our concentration to a major which has a core of 34
> hours.  Over the course of one year each of our three faculty will teach
> the following courses:
>
> Faculty #1  (16 credit hours)
>
> MET 330  Dynamics I
> MET 335  Dynamics II
> MET 320  Cloud Physics
> MET 201  Weather (for non-majors)
> MET 240  Meteorology (intro course for majors)
>
>
> Faculty #2  (17 credit hours)
>
> MET 250  Physical Properties of atmos
> MET 490  NWP (Considered to be our capstone)
> MET 310  Radiation and thermo
> MET 450  Mesoscale
> MET 210  Weather (for non-majors)
>
>
> Faculty #3  (16 credit hours)
>
> MET 240  Meteorology
> MET 460  Synoptic I
> MET 470  Synoptic II
> MET 302  Remote sensing of atmos
> MET 201  Weather (for non-majors)
>
> It is clear that you can have a very robust major that exceeds the
> minimum course recommendations with 3 faculty.  Obviously if teaching
> loads differ from this 3-2 model the # would need to be adjusted
> accordingly.
>
> Neil Mower.
>
>
> Before we start imposing minimum and recommended numbers of faculties, I
> think there needs to be some rationale for the numbers rather than just
> pulling a number out of a hat.  How do you arrive at 5 vs 2 or 7 or 20.
> Clearly, the required number depends on the number of courses to be
> taught in the program and the number of students that are serviced by
> the program.  A program with 25 students will have a completely
> different recommended number of faculty memebers than a program with
> 150.  Also, the scope of the courses taught will influence the
> recommended number.  I suspect that the absolute minimum number is easy
> to determine based on a single section of X number of courses required
> to complete the program divided by the standard teaching load.  I
> understand where Alan is coming from, I just don't think there is a
> simple answer to the recommended number of faculty.  Also, be careful
> for what you ask, if the number is too large, the program could be
> vulnerable to being eliminated.
>
>          I am not trying to be totaly negative on this issue, I just
> think we need to be able to justify our position.
>
>                               David
>
>>>> Alan Robock <robock at envsci.rutgers.edu> 10/20/04 03:06PM >>>
> Dear Mohan,
>
> 1.  As you know, I have already made the following suggestion:
>
> I think we need to specify recommended numbers of faculty and not just
>
> the minimum.  This would be very valuable for all departments seeking
> to
> hire more faculty.  In other disciplines, national accredidation panels
>
> specify the number of faculty needed, and AMS can do a similar service
>
> for us.  In the second paragraph from the bottom on page 4, I recommend
>
> the following change:
>
> "At undergraduate colleges with full-time teaching faculty, there
> should
> be a minimum of three faculty members, but the recommended level is
> five
> or more.  At research universities, where faculty devote a substantial
>
> amount of time to graduate teaching and research as well as
> undergraduate teaching, there should be a minimum of six faculty
> members, but the recommended level is ten or more to be able to cover
> all the necessary disciplinary areas.  The faculty members should have
>
> the expertise ..."
>
> ----
>
> 2.  In addition, a resolution was passed quickly at the end of the
> Heads
> and Chairs meeting in Boulder last week that recommended changes in the
>
> statement that would require 27 credits rather than 24 credits in the
> program.  I have not yet received a copy of it, but would like to
> recommend against it on a basic philosophical ground.
>
> An undergraduate liberal arts education is the last chance a student
> will have to take courses in literature, fine arts, humanities, and
> social "science."  Students can specialize as graduate students or go
> on
> learning about meteorology in their jobs, but I would not like to
> require that they take additional courses as part of their
> undergraduate
> major.  This will allow them to take other elective courses in subjects
>
> that will broaden them as people and citizens, which I think is more
> valuable than one more meteorology or related course.
>
> Thanks for considering my views.  I feel more strongly about the first
>
> one than the second one.
>
> Alan
>
> Professor Alan Robock
>   Editor, JGR - Atmospheres
>   Director, Center for Environmental Prediction
> Department of Environmental Sciences              Phone:
> +1-732-932-9478
> Rutgers University                                  Fax:
> +1-732-932-8644
> 14 College Farm Road                   E-mail:
> robock at envsci.rutgers.edu
> New Brunswick, NJ 08901-8551  USA
> http://envsci.rutgers.edu/~robock
>
>
> On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Brenda Ward wrote:
>
>>
>>>
>>> Dear Colleague,
>>>
>>> On behalf of the Board on Higher Education of the American
> Meteorological
>>> Society, I seek your comments on the revised draft statement on the
>
>>> Bachelor's Degree in Atmospheric Science.  The draft statement is
> available
>>> at:
>>>
>>>
> http://my.unidata.ucar.edu/content/publications/Bachelors_degree_stateme
> nt_2004.pdf
>
>>>
>>> For your background, the current AMS statement on this subject is
> available
>>> at:
>>>
>>>
> <http://www.ametsoc.org/policy/bachelor99.html>http://www.ametsoc.org/po
> licy/bachelor99.html
>
>>>
>>> Also, please share this draft statement with colleagues in your
> department.
>>> Please do not hesitate to contact me if you have any questions.  It
> would
>>> be most helpful if you can send me (mohan at ucar.edu) your comments by
> 15
>>> November.
>>>
>>> Thank you in anticipation,
>>>
>>> Mohan Ramamurthy
>>
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