Subject: [ESP] Rejoining ESP!

From: Christopher Kerr <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:47:02 -0400

Well after many emails from ESP members asking me to rethink my decision 
about leaving the Data Portal Project in addition to my management saying 
don't do it, I have decided to rejoin the project!

At our last meeting, we talked about having a followup meeting in England in 
September to talk about Data Portal Design and Meta Data Standards. I'm 
prepared to organize the meeting. Does anyone have any thoughts on the 
timing of the meeting and the agenda?

Christopher

Dr. Christopher L. Kerr
Geophysical Fluid Dynamics Laboratory
Forrestal Campus
Princeton University                             
Princeton, New Jersey  08542
Telephone: (609) 452-6573
Fax:       (609) 987-5063
Email:     [email-masked]
Web:       http://www.gfdl.gov/~ck

---

From: Don Middleton <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 08:57:42 -0600

Hi Chris and welcome back! I'm up for a UK meeting. As before, the 
first half of September is booked for a conference and I know a few of 
us are involved with that. The third week of September might work well 
for me as I'll be in Europe anyway, up through the 12th. Could just 
head to UK...

don

On Friday, June 6, 2003, at 08:47 AM, Christopher Kerr wrote:

> _______________________________________________
> ESP mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://mailman.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/esp

---

From: Steve Hankin <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:13:09 -0700

Welcome back, Chris!  Whoever twisted your arm, I am glad of it.

There is a major NVODS/OPeNDAP shindig Sept. 10-12 in DC -- a conflict to be
avoided.   Like Don, earlier in the month is problematic.  I'd lobby for late
September.

    - steve

===========================================

--

Steve Hankin, NOAA/PMEL -- [email-masked]
7600 Sand Point Way NE, Seattle, WA 98115-0070
ph. (206) 526-6080, FAX (206) 526-6744

---

From: Bryan Lawrence <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 08:20:24 +0100

Chris 

> don't do it, I have decided to rejoin the project!

This is excellent news!!
I'm very pleased.

> At our last meeting, we talked about having a followup meeting in England
> in September to talk about Data Portal Design and Meta Data Standards. I'm

It would have to be after the first two weeks of September from my point of 
view, and I could probably only manage at most a couple of days then ... I 
would prefer either the 15/16 or 18/19 I think ...

I'll get back to you on ideas for the agenda in a few days.

Cheers
Bryan

-- 
Bryan Lawrence, Head NCAS/British Atmospheric Data Centre
web: www.badc.nerc.ac.uk  phone: +44 1235 445012
CLRC: Rutherford Appleton Laboratory, Chilton, Didcot, OX110QX, UK

---

From: "Dean N. Williams" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 04:13:35 -0700

>don't do it, I have decided to rejoin the project!
Wow! What a welcome surprise! The project wasn't the same without you.

>timing of the meeting and the agenda?
On my calendar, I have an NDG-ESG AG meeting scheduled for Sept. 17th.  
Bryan can
correct me if I'm wrong. Since most of ESG team and the NDG team will be 
at this meeting, we
can possibly substitute this meeting for the AG meeting. I think I can 
rearrange my schedule to accommodate the meeting in Sept., but late 
Sept. would be best for me.

Best regards,
    Dean

---

From: "Glenn Rutledge" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 10:28:18 -0400

That is great news Chris.  Thanks (from the community).  We are so close 
to realizing the long term goals that we can all see, but of course are 
not quite there.  I'd like to give a quick update for you on my progress 
   here FYI and hopefully factor it in your plans.

NOMADS continues to develop, and even tho' I've not had much to say 
lately, a great deal of work is being done here at NCDC, NCEP, and 
Unidata, for the the Weather side of things.  We will soon (1-2 weeks) 
unveil a major new section on NCDC's main page that provides real-time 
access to NWP's, an Interface to plot browse and access thru both 
traditional (ftp, http (wget etc.) or image download), and thru NOMADian 
methods (our GrADS-DODS Server).  I've coordinated with NCEP greatly in 
these areas (see http://nomads.ncdc.noaa.gov/ncdc-ui/ncdc.html).  With 
the NCDC archive folks, I've also redesigned the entire existing archive 
that was not exactly organized in the best way, and developed a parallel 
ingest for them to conform to our NOMADS ingest.

We have already begun the Interface to the archive thru our GDS, which 
will give us access to NCDC's retrospective holdings.  Finally, we have 
begun the process of INgesting the New NCEP Regional Reanalysis that we 
will hold on disk (~10TB).  On the Grid side of things, we've configured 
our CEOS-Grid server w/ Globus and work with the CEOS Team on site 
monitoring tools they have established.  Next up is NOMADS access thru 
that Grid.

Our recent telconf calls w/ you and Leetma/Karl fall a bit short in my 
mind on it's purpose as requested by Ron Stouffer: the Model HelpDesk, 
but I'll work to do much of that on-line (explaining models etc.).  I've 
done that with US-based NWP;s for our site- and will do so for Climate. 
  My boss, Russ Vose, is advancing work with you (Brian?), on the new 
CLimate Normals using climate models.  He is on contact with GFDL on 
this action form the Leetma/Karl meetings.

I guess I state all this since it looks like I'd like to contribute as 
much as possible to serve up, or point to, the Climate side. Linking the 
NWP and climate is a priority, and I hope you can keep this in mind in 
your meetings.

Regarding metadata- maybe a focus on describing it rather on search 
would be first up.  Does NetCDF hold the answers for GFDL/NCAR/PCMDI, or 
does this need work?

The discovery part is major, and I still look to THREDDS for these 
answers even tho' that is in the future...

Thanks again for stepping up to this...and let me know how I can best be 
involved.    Regards, Glenn

---

From: Lola M Olsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 10:30:07 -0400

Glenn,

We are working to provide the discovery part if you are still interested.

Lola

At 10:28 AM -0400 6/9/03, Glenn Rutledge wrote:
>That is great news Chris.  Thanks (from the community).  We are so 
>close to realizing the long term goals that we can all see, but of 
>course are not quite there.  I'd like to give a quick update for you 
>on my progress   here FYI and hopefully factor it in your plans.
>
>Unidata, for the the Weather side of things.  We will soon (1-2 
>weeks) unveil a major new section on NCDC's main page that provides 
>real-time access to NWP's, an Interface to plot browse and access 
>thru both traditional (ftp, http (wget etc.) or image download), and 
>thru NOMADian methods (our GrADS-DODS Server).  I've coordinated 
>with NCEP greatly in these areas (see 
>http://nomads.ncdc.noaa.gov/ncdc-ui/ncdc.html).  With the NCDC 
>archive folks, I've also redesigned the entire existing archive that 
>was not exactly organized in the best way, and developed a parallel 
>We have already begun the Interface to the archive thru our GDS, 
>which will give us access to NCDC's retrospective holdings. 
>Finally, we have begun the process of INgesting the New NCEP 
>Regional Reanalysis that we will hold on disk (~10TB).  On the Grid 
>side of things, we've configured our CEOS-Grid server w/ Globus and 
>work with the CEOS Team on site monitoring tools they have 
>established.  Next up is NOMADS access thru that Grid.
>
>Our recent telconf calls w/ you and Leetma/Karl fall a bit short in 
>my mind on it's purpose as requested by Ron Stouffer: the Model 
>HelpDesk, but I'll work to do much of that on-line (explaining 
>models etc.).  I've done that with US-based NWP;s for our site- and 
>will do so for Climate.  My boss, Russ Vose, is advancing work with 
>you (Brian?), on the new CLimate Normals using climate models.  He 
>is on contact with GFDL on this action form the Leetma/Karl meetings.
>
>I guess I state all this since it looks like I'd like to contribute 
>as much as possible to serve up, or point to, the Climate side. 
>Linking the NWP and climate is a priority, and I hope you can keep 
>this in mind in your meetings.
>
>would be first up.  Does NetCDF hold the answers for 
>GFDL/NCAR/PCMDI, or does this need work?
>
>Thanks again for stepping up to this...and let me know how I can 
>best be involved.    Regards, Glenn
>
>
>
>Christopher Kerr wrote:
>>Well after many emails from ESP members asking me to rethink my 
>>decision about leaving the Data Portal Project in addition to my 
>>management saying don't do it, I have decided to rejoin the project!
>>
>>At our last meeting, we talked about having a followup meeting in 
>>England in September to talk about Data Portal Design and Meta Data 
>>Standards. I'm prepared to organize the meeting. Does anyone have 
>>any thoughts on the timing of the meeting and the agenda?
>>
>>Christopher
>>
>>Dr. Christopher L. Kerr

---

From: "Glenn Rutledge" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 10:48:23 -0400

Yes Lola,
I am still interested- and apologies for the slip.  I think Ted Haberman 
under the FGDC effort should be mentioned but not sure how much 
discovery is in his thinking....  I think we should get him on-board 
since tho' since he seems to be representing NOAA folks !!!   Glenn

---any info you have on your efforts would be appreciated...

Lola M Olsen wrote:
>> traditional (ftp, http (wget etc.) or image download), and thru 
>> NOMADian methods (our GrADS-DODS Server).  I've coordinated with NCEP 
>> greatly in these areas (see 
>> http://nomads.ncdc.noaa.gov/ncdc-ui/ncdc.html).  With the NCDC archive 
>> folks, I've also redesigned the entire existing archive that was not 
>> exactly organized in the best way, and developed a parallel ingest for 
>> them to conform to our NOMADS ingest.
>>
>> begun the process of INgesting the New NCEP Regional Reanalysis that 
>> we will hold on disk (~10TB).  On the Grid side of things, we've 
>> configured our CEOS-Grid server w/ Globus and work with the CEOS Team 
>> on site monitoring tools they have established.  Next up is NOMADS 
>> access thru that Grid.
>>
>> but I'll work to do much of that on-line (explaining models etc.).  
>> I've done that with US-based NWP;s for our site- and will do so for 
>> Climate.  My boss, Russ Vose, is advancing work with you (Brian?), on 
>> the new CLimate Normals using climate models.  He is on contact with 
>> GFDL on this action form the Leetma/Karl meetings.
>>
>> much as possible to serve up, or point to, the Climate side. Linking 
>> the NWP and climate is a priority, and I hope you can keep this in 
>> mind in your meetings.
>>
>> would be first up.  Does NetCDF hold the answers for GFDL/NCAR/PCMDI, 
>> or does this need work?
>>
>> Thanks again for stepping up to this...and let me know how I can best 
>> be involved.    Regards, Glenn
>>
>>
>>
>> Christopher Kerr wrote:
>>
>>> Standards. I'm prepared to organize the meeting. Does anyone have any 
>>> thoughts on the timing of the meeting and the agenda?
>>>
>>> Christopher
>>>
>>> Dr. Christopher L. Kerr
>>> Princeton University                            Princeton, New 
>>> Jersey  08542

---

From: Ethan Davis <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 13:10:59 -0600

Hi all,

Just wanted to add a brief note to this discovery discussion.

I would say THREDDS is working on discovery issues at a slightly different
granularity than GCMD. THREDDS is working with many of you and others on ways to
better describe individual datasets to improve usability. And also on how to
abstract information from individual datasets to describe a collection of
datasets. For example, the Unidata community receives ~10 products from ~150
radar sites every 5-15 minutes (that's a few products every second). GCMD and
other search services will probably want a description of the collection rather
than each individual dataset. Hopefully THREDDS tools will help data providers
gather information, at the level appropriate for the data being described, to
feed into the GCMD and other search services.

With good abstractions and ways for communicating those abstractions (and the
related query language), data user tools can allow the users to drill down into
the collection as desired.

Ethan

> At 10:28 AM -0400 6/9/03, Glenn Rutledge wrote:
[snip]
> >answers even tho' that is in the future...
[snip]

-- 
Ethan R. Davis                       Telephone: (303) 497-8155
Software Engineer                    Fax:       (303) 497-8690
UCAR Unidata Program Center          E-mail:    [email-masked]
P.O. Box 3000
Boulder, CO  80307-3000              http://www.unidata.ucar.edu/